Love Unbound: Navigating Relationships, Attraction, and Authenticity | Exploring the Complexity of Connections, Monogamy, and Polyamory

[TRANSCRIPT]

**0:00:00** - (Chad): A girl might go walk around the room advertising that she's available interview you.

**0:00:05** - (Michael): In the sense of she's flicking her hair, she's giving you a look, give you a look.

**0:00:09** - (Chad): You might come up and say, what up?

**0:00:10** - (Michael): She's dressed right.

**0:00:11** - (Chad): She might give like but she's still gonna walk around the room. We were talking about like, well, you know that I don't really want to be second best. Like, the girl's got to be into me. She's got to love me. She's got to really, actually be really.

**0:00:23** - (Michael): Got to be interested.

**0:00:24** - (Chad): Yeah. Or if not, then it's like, yeah, no second best because they'll never actually lead into anything. So unless you both know that and make that agreement exactly, then so be it. Now, what I learned about laws of attraction is what you put out is what you get. So if you're like, I only want women who are fully into me in that moment. You now have to only be into women that you are fully into. If you give and get into women that you're settling for, you are now going to be with women who are.

**0:00:57** - (C): Going to settle for you.

**0:00:59** - (Chad): And so you have to eliminate any aspect of that out of your life for it not to reflect and attract in your reality, because it would be that subconscious aspect of life that would appear and show up again and again. If you're not following in what you're calling in because you're then not stepping up to that frequency and embodying that calling. You know what I'm saying?

**0:01:23** - (Michael): And it's a choice. Let's just the example. If you're choosing to only attract the ones who you're into each other, by the way, just for me, that does not mean a girlfriend. That doesn't mean a wife. That doesn't mean a partner. That just means somebody I'm connecting with because I don't even like to label them. But if you only want the ones who want you, that's just a choice. That could be because of the space of my life that I'm in, it's like if I'm going to spend the time getting to know somebody, I want them to be totally into me. Now, if I was younger, I think maybe I'd be in a situation where you more want to maybe hang out with a lot of people, I guess date, I guess what that would be, I don't know.

**0:02:17** - (Chad): Well, and that funny enough. That's kind of the term because I mean, it's funny that you say date because I've actually had conversations with females about like, well, what do you consider dating? Because when you start to talk about polyamory or monogamy, at what point do you define a date? Does a date mean you're having dinner with someone and talking with them and getting to know about them?

**0:02:39** - (C): Because if that's the case, then shit.

**0:02:41** - (Chad): You and I went on a date to Catmandu.

**0:02:43** - (Michael): Sure.

**0:02:43** - (Chad): You know what I'm saying?

**0:02:45** - (C): Get to know about each other and talk more about business and what we.

**0:02:47** - (Chad): Can create together is that not a date. We also set aside a date in time to then put a business meeting.

**0:02:54** - (Michael): Which is what that word comes from, I'm sure. Exactly.

**0:02:57** - (Chad): It's like, hey, let's make a date. Plan a date.

**0:03:00** - (Michael): What time?

**0:03:01** - (Chad): Let's make it a date. So that's why when you date people, it means that you're simply setting aside time to get together. To get together and to know that create something and relate. So in that case, we date our friends. But if we don't want to get that technical and whatever you want to say, that's what I'm saying. Like, what is the definition you have to ask and define? Are we even speaking the same language, though? We use the same words and most of the time I would say no.

**0:03:29** - (Michael): The big question I would ask now is and why are you doing it? And whatever the reason is, it's fine, but I think you need to be honest with yourself or at least know. Are you doing it because you want to find a partner and have a baby and you're dating to find somebody who qualifies? I mean, really doing that? I don't know how many people really do that. It seems like more people want it, possibly, but then they just live life and then maybe fall in love with somebody.

**0:03:56** - (Chad): I mean, I hate to categorize it. I would only imagine the people who look and do that are like Mormons who get out of school, get married, have a kid, live the American. That's right. But like I say, I don't want to categorize it.

**0:04:07** - (Michael): But that's what well, I went through. That exactly where I was literally looking to get married and do the whole everything. It was a step by step process. That's just it. First you do this, then you do this, then you do that, and the next thing is this. And you're like looking to get to the end, which is for Mormons, being sealed in the temple and having kids, that's the end all. Be all on the spiritual path and then live the commandments. And so there was a brainwashing in me, jeez, I almost got married, like, well, I did get married young, but I almost got married 21.

**0:04:44** - (Michael): And why? Because he wanted to have sex. I think ultimately if we would have been honest with ourselves and be like, look, I'm just horny. But anyway, putting away the Mormonism so we don't get locked into that thinking and coming back to more of a practical standpoint is if you're looking for a partner, then you got to define what that is and why you're looking what you're looking for. If you're looking to get laid, then be honest with yourself and maybe be honest with the other person. I don't know. I don't love the hookup culture.

**0:05:20** - (Michael): And maybe the most honest is looking to connect because it's nice to connect and meet new people and find out.

**0:05:27** - (C): What you have in common, especially if you're attracted.

**0:05:32** - (Michael): But another case in point, man, do we even choose our relationships? It seems like, first off, they just happen. Second off, I don't remember choosing them myself. I remember thinking, oh, I like you. I want to be on, be around you. But I don't remember deciding. In fact, I have never officially had a girlfriend, I don't think, my entire life. I was married twice. They weren't my girlfriends.

**0:05:59** - (Chad): They're my friends. I don't know, friends that are girls.

**0:06:03** - (Michael): And one of them, they just kind of ended up before you knew it was. But I didn't choose it.

**0:06:10** - (C): This would have happened.

**0:06:13** - (Chad): Now, at this point, funny enough, I almost want to start talking about titles and words and the meanings of words.

**0:06:19** - (Michael): Yeah, this is more where I'm at.

**0:06:21** - (Chad): I just because yeah, because girl friend. Friend. That is girl playmate.

**0:06:27** - (Michael): That's another word that I like, playmate.

**0:06:30** - (Chad): Which, yet again, could be guy or girl. Does that mean sexual? Sensual. What does sensual mean? Most people are like, oh, we got so sensual. Well, sensual is something that you can sense, which means you guys listen to music. You guys watched a movie. You've sensed it, you see it, you hear it, you smell it. You guys made dinner together, whatever it was, you guys lit incense together and watched an album. That's sensual.

**0:06:53** - (Chad): And then you spoke, and so I could hear you. That's sensual.

**0:06:57** - (Michael): So, weirdly enough, sensual. Yeah. Which, just to be clear, you go from intimate to sensual, which is not sexual.

**0:07:06** - (C): And sexuality is in its own category itself, which is basically genital in court.

**0:07:12** - (Michael): Up to that point. You are sensual until you the physical act.

**0:07:16** - (Chad): And I think when you stimulate that energy, because strangely enough, is a kiss sexual? Not necessarily, but it can very much be that too, because you can kiss your kid on the forehead good night. Well, hey, that's not a sexual kiss. Sensual kiss. But can a kiss be sexual? Very much so. It's an energy. So I think it's when stimulating that energy is sexual, but sensuality. Most people think, like I said, sensuality.

**0:07:41** - (C): When you ask them, hey, what's that? Do you get sensual with men?

**0:07:44** - (Chad): No.

**0:07:45** - (Michael): Engage in senses. Engaging in senses, smelling, touching, tasting, all those things.

**0:07:49** - (Chad): Have you ever smelled the man's lungs?

**0:07:51** - (C): You've been sensual.

**0:07:52** - (Michael): Sorry, buddy. Have you heard the term relationship anarchy?

**0:07:59** - (Chad): No.

**0:08:01** - (Michael): Okay, so relationship anarchy, now, where this information comes from is more of the polyamory content. So they're talking about the different kinds of thinking. Relationship anarchy rejects the labels and the hierarchy of relationships. So it's the connection alone. It's really probably better to read because it's written very clearly, meaning the mailman, the woman at the grocery store, your girlfriend, your wife. You're not giving anyone some kind of priority. You don't have your main wife, and then everybody else is subservient to that.

**0:08:35** - (Michael): Like some polyamorous situations where you've got your primary and then you've got these other subservient type of the relation of ironarchy just rejects all of that and just basically engages in the relationship as it is. That's more how I roll.

**0:08:51** - (Chad): At least that's why I feel like I do.

**0:08:53** - (Michael): Like, I'm going to connect with everybody in a bunch of different ways. Some of them are sexual, sensual, et cetera, et cetera, to label it. And then the problem is with labels is then it puts you into a framework that's already written. Like when you get married, whether you like it or not, you are tapping into an exorb marriage. And any way you thought you could mentally avoid it by making up your own rules don't seem to apply. You got married, you're in. This is how marriage works.

**0:09:20** - (Michael): So I reject most I would say I'm a relationship anarchist if I had to give myself a label.

**0:09:28** - (Chad): And I think that's exactly going back to those titles, as soon as you say girlfriend, whatever that means to you, most people now have expectations and attachments to the definition of that title. So all of sudden, a, hey, you're my girlfriend. Well, that now means that if you're holding hands with somebody else, I'm going to get jealous because you're my girlfriend. Ownership and titles of these expectations.

**0:09:51** - (Chad): Now, I think it's human nature in certain things.

**0:09:55** - (C): Like, truly, when you look at it in any feminism, like and I'm not talking creative aspect, shall we say, with.

**0:10:02** - (Chad): Human, if you were drawing and coloring, you would eventually color and see what the colors looked like together. You would eventually see what different colors looked like together.

**0:10:11** - (C): You would play and you would create all this stuff. I can also expand it into a video game.

**0:10:17** - (Chad): If you were playing a video game and you had a character like The.

**0:10:20** - (C): Sims or something like that, you would see how your character related with every single person.

**0:10:25** - (Chad): You would create it. You would make it that way because you'd be curious of how and who and what it looks like, what it feels like, what it sounds like. Sensuality. You would get sensual with yourself and the experiences around you because you want.

**0:10:39** - (C): To taste the food around you. You want to hear the music around you, hear people's thoughts, and you want.

**0:10:44** - (Chad): To speak about your feelings, about how it's all making you feel and stuff. You know what I mean? I think it's human nature. So as soon as we all sudden get into these relationships, strapping a title to it. It prevents the nature of the exploration of seeing or sensing how something would turn out, because it prevents us from the truest and more deepest experiences of actually being in the moment.

**0:11:13** - (Chad): Because we're like, oh, she has a boyfriend. So I don't want to make Homie jealous across the lines or for all these things. Therefore, I won't express my truest, deepest self. Though if you did, who's to say that three months down the line homeboy is cheating with whatever anyways? And you guys wouldn't have been the best couple. But for some reason, you're stuck to this primary program of allegiance, thinking that it's some honor system and code of respect when really you truly just screwed yourself over from your life partner.

**0:11:41** - (Michael): Yes.

**0:11:48** - (Chad): Say that again.

**0:11:49** - (C): Oh, you're doing a podcast. Sorry.

**0:11:52** - (Michael): No, it's fine. We're letting a bee. We're letting a beef.

**0:11:55** - (Chad): Yeah, it's got raw. It's got to be raw.

**0:11:58** - (Michael): Yeah, as long as we can keep the audio decent, I can hear it.

**0:12:04** - (Chad): Yeah.

**0:12:07** - (Michael): It'S just interesting because our minds use frameworks to understand things, and it's easier that way. And so we get raised with these frameworks and play these games, be guided down these paths like marriage, babies, and that picket fence and the American Dream and that can go into dating. And then you get the whole like, say, polyamory scene. You got a whole bunch more frameworks to work with. I think that's great. And then you bring in the transsexual stuff. Now you got a whole nother series of frameworks you're dealing with, you know what I mean?

**0:12:41** - (Michael): But to remove all frameworks and be authentic raw in the moment and let it open and flow as it only can, without any resistance of where it goes because it's moving outside of your expected framework, to me, that's the only free way. And if there is such a thing as unconditional love, that's where you're getting into it. And that's because you're honoring yourself first and being honest with the connection.

**0:13:09** - (Michael): And I will say, for me, removing most of the frameworks, you literally don't know how to deal with it, the relationships. And so the only way I've been able to really take it on is taking baby steps slowly into every connection and continuing to take baby steps until there comes a point where the baby step feels intuitively uncomfortable. And then I'll stop. And that's an interesting thing to do because sometimes you keep walking.

**0:13:38** - (Michael): And the connections that you might have said no to for a variety of reasons, I won't give examples. You didn't because you didn't let the framework get in the way. And you keep going deeper and deeper into intimacy based on how deeply that person is willing to go and never putting a label on it, never getting rules, at least for the most part. I mean, I don't think you can fully remove yourself, but you're still going to get a little bit of jealousy and stuff like that, I think, no matter what.

**0:14:16** - (Chad): I just also want to just to clarify, you're more than welcome to put your input. I just wanted to point out.

**0:14:25** - (Michael): Yeah, he was suggesting to talk into it.

**0:14:33** - (C): Sorry.

**0:14:33** - (Chad): Welcome.

**0:14:35** - (Michael): I don't know, but I wouldn't mind hearing any of your take on polyamory if you have thoughts.

**0:14:41** - (Chad): So yet again, that's a title which then I looked up the definition of polyamory. And now it was a while ago, but basically it does talk about partners that all are very much aware of each other, that are not all sexual with each other, but certain ones of each group or whatever are aware of other partners sexuality, and you are expressing your sexuality with each of them. So it's not cheating and just, oh, I have multiple sexual partners, but none of them know they all are in a committed relationship, whether all are sexual or not.

**0:15:19** - (Chad): Certain of them are. But group commitment is what it is. And so with that idea, group commitment, well, that just sounds like community. That sounds like if you actually had a loving, caring family and your sister was getting abused by her boyfriend, your family would sit down and talk very deeply about that. They would all be involved because they're not going to stand for that shit. And it's going to end now because that's my family that is happening to.

**0:15:51** - (Chad): But this day and age because family.

**0:15:52** - (C): Is so broken apart, I don't even.

**0:15:54** - (Chad): Know what to do. And then you call the cops. And the cops are like, well, you got to prove it. Nothing happens. And everybody's just like, well, he just beats her. And so you start drinking because what the fuck? And this is what I'm talking about, is when it comes down to polyamory relationships, cheating people, talking to other people, boyfriends, girlfriends, the conniving that not up front, being like, yeah, I like her too.

**0:16:19** - (Chad): Why can't I like Dr. Pepper and rubier? I like multiple things. I like this person. I like that person. I want to get to know both of them. And if I could, I would like.

**0:16:29** - (C): To be sexual with both of them. Let's say hypothetically or not, but I.

**0:16:33** - (Chad): Do yet again, believe it's human nature that most people probably feel this way or have felt this way at some point.

**0:16:40** - (C): The only reason I truly feel that.

**0:16:42** - (Chad): Monogamy, which I'm still thinking that monogamy could be human nature. Why? Because it is in nature, in itself. Certain animals are monogamous. They choose one partner and stay with that partner. A lot aren't. So when we talk about human nature or animal nature, let's just talk about nature instinct. Babies, love babies. Connection, meeting connection, I guarantee, at the heart of every single person if they could, without jealousy, without the repercussions of a partner getting hurt, if everyone was filled and going back to jealousy, where does jealousy or envy stem from? I think it stems from a place or a state of lacking that. Would you really be jealous that your partner was spending time with someone else if you then had someone else to spend time with that was just as interesting, as beautiful, as cool, as good looking as your partner?

**0:17:36** - (Chad): No, you would actually be down because it's satisfying. It's not like taking a really dope, delicious, amazing meal and now somebody giving you a shitty cheeseburger or something. You're actually getting another amazing meal and.

**0:17:48** - (Michael): Replacing here's what it is. There's a lie in there. And the lie is that if that person gives their love to someone else, it's taking the love away from you.

**0:17:57** - (Chad): That they don't love you anymore.

**0:17:59** - (Michael): But that is not the nature of love because love is giving and abundant. So the truth is in my world is the more love I give to each, the more love expands to all because I'm getting love from multiple places and I can share that. But there's a lie in there that says because they're mine and they give their love to someone else, is taken away from me. And in some cases the attention is going away from the one and going to this other person.

**0:18:29** - (Michael): And that is a problem, I guess, if you're in a committed monogamous relationship. Speaking of monogamy, I think monogamy is really important and very much part of nature as it relates to children and protecting the children and survival.

**0:18:49** - (Chad): Yeah, well, and I can see that in nature yet again, because look through nature and look at when monogamy in certain species are there and why are they there and they are protecting. But also look at certain species where they do raise in community, like prides and they raise in community. And the dad is not absent. He's there or whatever, the male. But the females mainly raise their young.

**0:19:17** - (Michael): And then they need to be protected while they're nursing and taking care of the babies. So then you got the partner in the crime. They're protecting and bringing the food in. I mean, just as a very natural animal level, you can see how the female would be vulnerable while she takes care of the children. The children are ultimately vulnerable and you would need that one more protection which also can be done in a community. So I really like what you said about I really like what you said about female lions, like polyamory being like a family unit where you watch after each other.

**0:19:51** - (Michael): I think that's a group agreement. I think that that's an interesting concept that resonated anyway.

**0:20:03** - (Chad): Yeah, I don't know, just because I now can see through some of my family and through the community that in the places of my family that did stay together. Meaning no chauvinistic or not. But truly, the place that made family home was in the kitchen, was when the females actually started having children and stopped being rebellious and came back to the mother and was like, wow, you know what? I respect you so much more because of how hard this is and I need help.

**0:20:31** - (Chad): And then the grandmother helps the daughter who then has the granddaughter and all of sudden a now you have this chain of women, powerful women helping and growing. So now all of sudden A, a family event occurs and there's a new baby in the house, of course everyone wants to see them but let's be honest, who are the ones that are like oh baby. Like truly of the grandmother, the mothers, all the ones that have had that experience and now they love it, they grab the baby, they take care of the baby, everyone loves it. Where's the dad? The dad talking and relaxing and experience maybe helping barbecue, I mean who knows.

**0:21:03** - (Michael): What maybe in the garage.

**0:21:04** - (Chad): Yeah, maybe in the garage. Maybe holding the baby too. I'm not trying to be, I'm just more truly painting a picture when it really happens. Who is the ones that seek it out and now paint a community where everything is full of love? Is there really needing a father in the picture? 24/7 no, he needs to be a strong present father but in all honesty, community would raise that child, male or female. It would be a strong community family.

**0:21:36** - (Michael): It would love and it wouldn't be put all on the mother who birthed the child.

**0:21:39** - (Chad): I don't think it would not be. It takes a tribe to raise a kid or whatever and it's because that kid needs all aspects. It needs the ratio of friend, cousin.

**0:21:51** - (Michael): Father not just mom and dad but the whole lot.

**0:21:53** - (Chad): Yeah, brother, sister too. Like maybe not but I truly believe that give everybody a title if you want to strap titles to something give.

**0:22:01** - (Michael): Them a family, brother, sister, mother, father.

**0:22:08** - (Chad): And then truly see how then we flourish when there's a family.

**0:22:11** - (Michael): Just like family unit is what's in under attack and it really is true that if you have a community or a group you have other perspectives to rely on or to go to. If you don't have that then by default you have your perspective controlled by the state which is what is happening. And so there is something about having that group or community bigger the better. And just to stretch this out all the way, I was trying to be 100% honest with myself because somebody asked something online, and I won't try to remember the question. But ultimately, I decided if I had the ultimate vision of what I would be, it'd be more like Abraham from the Bible with multiple wives concubines and then whatever kind of animals and stuff, because I think about that image, and that means that the babies within your family are growing your kingdom and your group.

**0:23:10** - (Michael): No cross breeding here because you've got multiple wives, the concubines, you've basically taken them off the sexual marketplace because you pay for their living but it's still your kingdom. And that's all I have to say about that is I just think that that's a very interesting way of building your own reality and it's completely protected against world perspective manipulation. I don't know how else to say it.

**0:23:39** - (Michael): All these conspiracy words are getting beat up so much it's just like the people who want to control everyone's thoughts tell me that's not happening. And I think the family core, whatever that looks like, even if it's all the way out to this Abraham power where there's full control versus like a mother child and dad, that's the smallest unit is the protection of our survival.

**0:24:08** - (Chad): Do you see what we would call polygamy in nature for survival?

**0:24:13** - (Michael): I think polygamy makes sense and well.

**0:24:15** - (Chad): Not only for survival, for pleasure. And most people like, well, what but if you were a god and you had your own desires but also I'm just more is it in nature? Does a lion now, let's really look at a pride. And I only believe there is one male in a pride unless there's the children of it, but I'll have to look deeper into that. But really a lot of the videos that I've seen, I really actually want to say that the females own the pride hunt, do all the hunting, do all the everything.

**0:24:42** - (Chad): And there's like the one man for breeding and then the other ones get like basically exiled. They're pushed out to go claim other land eventually and they start other packs of prides, just like alpha wolves and stuff that the alpha wolf actually goes around and freaking just does what he wants with all and whatever females through the pack. And so in a weird way, is it in nature, so therefore is it in human nature or dog nature, animal nature?

**0:25:09** - (Chad): Is it part of the collective life circle of life? And if it is, then we tap into it because all of the universe exists within ourselves, which means that we at nature, at instinct, have these basic instincts, these basic desires, these basic actions and needs and wants that we can tap into. We can override and overcome them too. But it's all how we program ourselves well.

**0:25:36** - (Michael): And I think there are things that can't really be programmed over. There are certain parts of our just physical biology, like the simple fact that men's sperm can continue to impregnate hundreds of women, but one woman can get.

**0:25:51** - (Chad): Pregnant and only hold that for the night.

**0:25:54** - (Michael): Yeah. And that is going to play out a lot of the human behavior between the sexes because they're going to be built to nurture and protect and do the things that you do when you're having babies and becoming a mother and all of that. And to me it seems very much a natural part of that nature for that man to protect that woman and that baby and make sure that everything's perfect for them. That makes sense to me.

**0:26:33** - (Michael): There are some I think that just bell. He's pregnant. You're like, I'm out. Good idea. This.